Strange feeder behaviour

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vladkon
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Strange feeder behaviour

Post by vladkon » Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:21 am

Hello All, I am experiencing some strange behaviour with one of the feeders. There are persistent feeders enabled in the model. I changed the rules so that there are no feeders in this cube, stopped TM1 service and deleted .feeder file. I expected that there will be no .feeder file created after the restart, yet there still is. Also checked that there are no feeeders in other cubes pointing to this cube. Any ideas what else can it be?
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by tomok » Mon Jul 03, 2017 12:20 pm

Do your rules pull in values from other cubes? Perhaps you still have feeders in those cubes for the intercube references?
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PavoGa
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by PavoGa » Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:27 pm

The feeder file will be created for a cube if any cell in that cube is fed. As tomok indicates, if another cube's rules are feeding the cube in question, you will get a feeder file as long as PersistentFeeders=T in the tm1s.cfg file.
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vladkon
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by vladkon » Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:53 am

PavoGa wrote:The feeder file will be created for a cube if any cell in that cube is fed. As tomok indicates, if another cube's rules are feeding the cube in question, you will get a feeder file as long as PersistentFeeders=T in the tm1s.cfg file.
That is what I thought, but I deleted all other rules files from the model. The only rule file left is for the cube in question and it has no feeders section!
The only other suspect is function ConsolidateChildren - could it be that it causes feeders creation?

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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by lotsaram » Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:29 am

The mere presence of a rule file, even if empty, will cause creation of a .feeders file for the same cube.
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by vladkon » Sun Jul 09, 2017 9:47 am

lotsaram wrote:The mere presence of a rule file, even if empty, will cause creation of a .feeders file for the same cube.
Interesting. Than what is stored in that file if not feeders info?
I am trying to recreate the model without feeders for currency calculations, to see if it will improve performance. Not sure what is the point of not using feeders, if there is still a feeders file created, even if there are no feeders...

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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by macsir » Sun Jul 09, 2017 11:35 am

Try to turn of persistent feeders in cfg file and see.
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by lotsaram » Sun Jul 09, 2017 4:42 pm

vladkon wrote:Interesting. Than what is stored in that file if not feeders info?
I am trying to recreate the model without feeders for currency calculations, to see if it will improve performance. Not sure what is the point of not using feeders, if there is still a feeders file created, even if there are no feeders...
Any cube with a rule associated with it must have a feeders file if using persistent feeders. This is necessary so that on session start the server can validate that the feeder file is same or later time stamped than the cube file. If the feeder file is older this will invalidate all feeder files and cause reprocessing of feeders. So even if a feeder file is completely empty it still needs to serve this purpose.
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by vladkon » Mon Jul 10, 2017 10:36 am

lotsaram wrote: Any cube with a rule associated with it must have a feeders file if using persistent feeders. This is necessary so that on session start the server can validate that the feeder file is same or later time stamped than the cube file. If the feeder file is older this will invalidate all feeder files and cause reprocessing of feeders. So even if a feeder file is completely empty it still needs to serve this purpose.
Understood. But it is far from being empty - it takes about 16Gb of disk space. Feeders as per definition should include only data on n-level cells, correct? If there is no feeder section in the rule file, what could it be that takes such an amount of disk space, and how it can be reduced?

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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by vladkon » Mon Jul 10, 2017 10:43 am

What I am trying to say, is that it seems not only feeder section controls feeders creation, but also rules some rules statements, for example ConsolidateChildren. If this is true, than it also should be taken into account when optimizing feeders.

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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by lotsaram » Mon Jul 10, 2017 12:59 pm

vladkon wrote:What I am trying to say, is that it seems not only feeder section controls feeders creation, but also rules some rules statements, for example ConsolidateChildren. If this is true, than it also should be taken into account when optimizing feeders.
No. Only feeder statements create feeders. Rules and feeders are independent. Feeders are only used for consolidation, period. That's all they do.

If you have a 16 gb feeder file and the rule for that cube contains no feeders then (assuming the server had been restarted with feeders having been cleared with delete all persistent feeders command) the cube is being fed from another cube. Simple as that.
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Re: Strange feeder behaviour

Post by rpar » Tue Nov 02, 2021 5:36 am

ConsolidateChildren function does create feeders. With no feeder statements if you're seeing feeders in the }StatsByCube cube, ConsolidateChildren is the culprit.

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